The Real You
1:1 Long-Form Interviews with Interesting People Doing Amazing Things
In-depth discussion of people's journeys to tap into their full potential and find ways to be the truest version of themselves.
The Real You
EP 31: Choose Love Over Fear: Acacia Thornton's Path to Personal Growth & Adventure
Ever wondered what it's like to transition from a high-stakes legal career to a life of spiritual coaching and global adventuring?
Join me as I talk to Acacia Thornton, a former Fortune 500 attorney who traded the courtroom for the vibrant energy of Las Vegas and a fulfilling life as a digital nomad.
Acacia shares her journey from legal expert to award-winning speaker and coach, revealing how she balances the city's dynamic atmosphere with her own tranquil retreat away from the hustle and bustle of the Strip.
Discover how Las Vegas inspires her professional growth and how she thrives in her new, adventurous life.
Together, Acacia and I reflect on her individual path through the demanding world of law. From her formative years, which were steeped in challenges that honed her argumentative skills, to the competitive environment of law school and the pressures of legal careers, we explore how these experiences shaped her.
Our conversation also touches on the surprising turns that led her to pursue more heart-centered careers, challenging the conventional wisdom that career shifts mean financial setbacks. The power of self-care and listening to one's heart becomes a pivotal theme as we discuss how these choices doubled her income and enriched her life.
Embracing love as a force for healing, Acacia and I delve into stories of overcoming trauma and choosing love over fear. With insights from "A Course in Miracles" and plans for future travels, we explore how love can transform fear into gratitude and propel us forward in life.
Acacia shares her aspirations for continued personal growth and professional endeavors, including adding university instruction to her repertoire.
Join us on this journey of discovering your inner strength, embracing love, and pursuing happiness wherever it may lead you.
Acacia's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/acaciathornton/
Acacia's Website: https://www.acaciathornton.com/
David's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-young-mba-indy/
David's Website: https://davidjyoung.me/
Welcome to the Real you Podcast. This is episode number 31. I'm David Young, your host. I'm a LinkedIn content and business coach, and I help coaches and solopreneurs grow their businesses through better storytelling and content creation. I launched this podcast in March of 24 to spotlight interesting people doing amazing things, and today I'm thrilled to welcome Acacia Thornton, an award-winning speaker, former Fortune 500 attorney turned spiritual and business coach. An award-winning speaker, former Fortune 500 attorney turned spiritual and business coach, and a global citizen who now lives in Las Vegas. But she has spent quite a bit of time exploring the world as a digital nomad and I can't wait to talk more about that. We will dive into her fascinating journey from the courtroom to the keynote stage, how her legal expertise supports entrepreneurs and building thriving, soul-aligned businesses, and the stories and lessons for her global journey balancing a vibrant coaching career with life on the road. So, acacia, it's great to meet you for the first time and thank you so much for joining me today.
Speaker 2:I'm so excited to be here. David, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1:Awesome. So I want to start with Las Vegas. So you do reside there Now. I used to take a yearly trip to Vegas. I've been there nine times total. I haven't been there since 2011. So I haven't seen the sphere and many other newer things, but Vegas is a really interesting town that I can usually tolerate for about two or three days before I have to leave. So what is it like living there?
Speaker 2:Living here. I chose a place that's actually in the north part of the strip.
Speaker 2:I'm tiny to the strip, but I'm not in the crazy, crazy part of the strip. I can see even the sphere from my balcony and I love it. And one of the reasons I picked this is I moved here. I was off being a digital nomad for two years, was barely in the country during that whole time, took my job on the road. But unlike you, where you've been here nine times, I'm the type where I grew up around Vegas but not in Vegas. I lived in LA, I lived in Phoenix and my parents were here for work, so I was sometimes around Vegas, but not in Vegas. I lived in LA, I lived in Phoenix and my parents were here for work, so I was sometimes here nine 10 times a year.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, it was like my second home?
Speaker 2:Yes, and my job at the time was like you've got to come back to the country. You have to come back if you want the promotion. You got to come back and I was like have my digital nomad heart. I need excitement, I need novelty. But I also understood energy and vibration and for me to elevate my life into being a speaker, into creating more wealth, having the energy and vibrations about things that were new all the time. What was my other home? Vegas?
Speaker 2:Vegas, and so I get all of that on the strip, which is why I'm close enough to the Strip but far enough from the Strip to keep both my sanity and my excitement every day.
Speaker 1:I love it, I love it. Do you go? So you'll go down, I assume then you go down to the Strip and then go back.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm actually on the monorail line, that is how close I am, I can just hop on the monorail.
Speaker 1:Because I remember during some of my trips there we would talk to people that were local and they hated coming to the strip because they hated the tourists.
Speaker 2:The tourists yeah.
Speaker 1:They hated the lights and the shows and the people on the strip handing out all the stuff, and so they were like we rarely come down here. This is totally. This is only a visitor place. The locals don't come here, and so I always thought that was really interesting. But it sounds like you kind of like that part of it, because there is a lot of energy and it's a lot Like just walking. If you don't do anything and you just walk down the strip, it's a lot.
Speaker 2:It really can be a lot. And it is true, a lot of the locals don't come down to the strip, but, like with any amazing city in the world, there's so many reasons to love it. Some people love being away from the strip. I can tell you, I live in a condo high-rise, so I have hundreds of neighbors and we collectively go to the strip often. We love it. There are locals that you'll find down there. Of course, we do it a little bit differently. We're not having the drunken lose $1,000 weekends. That's not what we're doing. But that doesn't mean we don't appreciate how amazing it is down there, because it really is a unique place.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is. It's a fascinating place. The last time I was there the reason I was there is my friend had one entry into the World Series of Poker main event. Yeah, so it was really interesting they put together like a local tournament with a group of guys and the buy-in was like a thousand and they did a series of tournaments and they had 12 players. So the winner got like 11 000, which paid like travel, and the entry in second place got a thousand or something and it was like a seven month thing and they did points and it was very elaborate anyway.
Speaker 1:So this particular year my friend won. They've been doing it for several years. So he won, got entry, wanted somebody to go with him, and so I did. And what's interesting is I. So he played day one uh, I think it was at the rio, and I just played in an adjacent room, like not the main event, but just played. I played almost as much as he did like the same day and then like I would just go out and meet him in between breaks and I'd go back, uh, anyway, so we were there. I don't know why I remember this so clearly. So we wanted to have, we wanted to eat at the best steak place. So we would ask everyone like what is the best steak place? And we got it was one of those. Like we asked 20 people and we got 20 different answers.
Speaker 2:So we're like.
Speaker 1:This isn't. This isn't like. This isn't working. Can we please get like a consensus? And so, finally, what we ended up doing was, as soon as we heard the same steak place for the second time, that's the one we went to. It ended up being, I think it was Delmonico's, which I think was in the Venetian I don't know if it's still there and it was amazing. It was the best steak I've ever had.
Speaker 2:So it ended up working out but I just thought it was hilarious. I was like, well, there's a lot few, everybody's going to say the same one. It was like, nope, go here, go here, go here. I was like, oh, this is not helping at all. Steak, here is what Chicago style pizza is to Chicago, I lived in.
Speaker 2:Chicago for over a decade. I absolutely love it, but everybody has there's a particular style of Chicago pizza. Right, we all know what that is, but the best place for it that's a long list. At least three are going to be on a list and technically there's like five or seven. Everyone's going to have a different opinion. So it's true, here with steak, it definitely, definitely is that way.
Speaker 1:Nice.
Speaker 2:And Delmonico's is one that, if you're looking for a high-end, refined, you know dining experience, with a solid steak that you can rely on, that you know you're getting good value for it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, monaco's is still a great thing and, yeah, it's still in the, the restaurant, row over at venetian nice um so you're a big poker player uh, not really my. My friend was is a much better and a much bigger poker player. I I had a phase a really long time ago, um, and I played quite a bit of poker. I was never that good. I was too conservative most of the best players that I experienced.
Speaker 1:Just, you have to release the fear of losing, you have to be aggressive and you can't worry about winning and losing, and I was just too concerned with tight, with money and bets and always wanted to have the best hand, and that's not how poker is played. I got the math and I understood the logic and reading people and I just yeah, it wasn't me, but I enjoy card games. You know blackjack and poker. We played a lot of Euchre growing up. You probably don't know what that is.
Speaker 2:But I grew up in a cribbage household. I definitely know what.
Speaker 1:Euchre is Okay. So so, yeah, we, we like cards and we played a lot, but he's, he's, he got to be pretty good. I don it much anymore and they don't have that. They're not doing that event with his friends anymore, but uh, but it was interesting and he got pretty good with playing and poker is still quite big. I think they get still like seven or eight thousand people for the main event on these days like it's still a big, still a big draw definitely still a big draw.
Speaker 2:yeah, and there's actually a book I want to recommend to you, and I'm forgetting the name of it right now.
Speaker 2:just came out earlier this, and it's by one of the guys who does the stats for politics and poker and it's the whole thing about risk-taking, what that is in business and life, and what does it really mean to take a risk versus not? And is it just logical? Is it just math? What is that sort of je ne sais quoi? That other, that Nate I think it's Nate, something that would be a great book for you, nate Silver, probably because Nate Silver does politics. Then I believe that's right. I was going to say I think it's Nate Silver. He came out with a book earlier this year.
Speaker 1:Interesting. I didn't know he did. I know he does math and stats for politics. I didn't know he did poker. I read Annie Duke wrote a book several years ago. I think she's written two now and I can't remember the name of it off top of my head. That was interesting and it was about applying her life playing no limit hold'em to business and thoughts and she had really interesting the way she couched, he references it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she couched certain things about how risk and implied risk and reverse odds and all the things that you do playing poker, you can then apply to your life or business, and it was an interesting read. I should probably go back and revisit it, but it's yeah, I mean, there's a lot of lessons learned, you know, with risk taking and betting and gambling, because, let's be honest, this is all one big life, right, it's one big gamble.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, there's intuition. And then there's when do you really have the best card? Just because you don't have the best cards doesn't mean you can't win. That applies to everything, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2:The smartest people aren't the ones ruling the world the most. This and best, that, the best singers aren't the most famous, and so on. Best doesn't always equate to success. There's more that goes into it, and so, yeah, it's a to see it going into something that we always sort of at least I always did sat more mathematically.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure. Let's talk about your background. Did you know you wanted to be a lawyer? Growing up you wanted to be a lawyer, or you just decided, hey, let's go to law school and see what happens?
Speaker 2:Yes and no. What I would say is yeah, I know you want to get to what I speak on my background. Growing up was not a pleasant one, is what we will say, and so I ended up finding some grit to get through that. And one of the things I had I kind of want to use the word over my parents, or that I could use in defense, was my mind. I was more intelligent than my parents, and that became clear at a certain point, and so I could use my smarts. And one of the things that I found in a bin of paper in my dad's stuff my dad was an entrepreneur from home was this like little pamphlet of the text from the US Constitution, and I would use it. I would quote it to defend myself or my parents over controlling abuse, and so I grew up standing up to the scary people to the right in defense of, sometimes, my younger siblings and so on, and so that part of me was always there.
Speaker 2:Now, unfortunately, it came from a place of trauma survival there. Now, unfortunately, it came from a place of trauma survival. So, as great as a natural skill as it was, it also wasn't one that developed to be so strong from a healthy, loving situation and that ended up playing out in my legal career. But having that, and then my father seeing that I was such a good arguer and defender and also just being really book smart I've always been the honors kid, separated since kindergarten and all of that it just seemed like a natural career for me, for somebody who had never taken the time to know herself. So I had everything on the resume that would set me up for success as a lawyer and I went on to be a very successful lawyer where parts of that were who I really was, but parts of it, unfortunately, were from my upbringing, for better or worse.
Speaker 1:Got it Now. Did you enjoy law school? So my last year of college I lived with two my two roommates were in their final year of law school and they joked that I was kind of a de facto law student because I showed up Like I went with them to, like I played on the intramural flag football law team and I played on the basketball team and I was always like in the law building playing ping pong, and so I got like a little bit of an inside glimpse and I just remember them doing an inordinate amount of writing and reading. Did you like? Did you enjoy that? Because writing and reading, did you enjoy that? Because that seems like that's all they ever did.
Speaker 2:What was really? Yes, yes, that is what law school is. It's going to change how you think. You're going to write a lot. You're going to read a lot. I love reading. I read a lot. We've already talked about Nate Silver's book. I read a lot, I love it.
Speaker 2:The writing part I didn't really love growing up at all. What was hard me, though, is, while I was going through law school, I was pushing myself to do something I thought I was supposed to do. This should do. This is what you're good at. You do it, but I was also working full-time. So trying to work full-time, do that, support myself. Then go to law school, and when you take law school part-time, you're only taking one less class than the full-time students One less class. You have to take four classes still, so it was a heavy load. So that's my way of saying I didn't get all my reading done. I would try to find ways to Exactly Something had to cut. Sometimes it was laundry or the dishes, or sleep. Other times it was is that case necessary? Or things like that.
Speaker 1:No, yeah, I definitely could see that that is a lot, because I don't know. I mean, I feel like they were just always studying and writing and working or reading, so trying to mix a full-time job into that. You didn't have a lot of free time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and one thing that's different about law school is well, every school you go to, there's the idea of who's the valedictorian, who's number one, but the entire idea of law school is to compete against each other. You have to compete on your LSATs, you have to compete to get into a law school. Once you're in it. Now you have to fight for your placement. For 90% of those students, it will be the first time in their life they're not in the top 10% of the class. When you're 25 years old, a quarter of a century old, and you've never not been the best, it hurts and you give it everything you have and you've got to do that. And you're fighting to the very, very end. Because even if it didn't happen, year one doesn't mean you can't figure it out by year three, and so it's not just learning, it is a inner battle of competition that pushes you further than you've realized. You could go for better or worse.
Speaker 1:In some ways, though, it's probably good that they face that, because at some point you're not going to be the best, right. Most people don't just like in that top one or two percent forever, and there's always going to be those kind of bumps. So it would be nice if it happened earlier than that, but it's probably good that it happened then and not when they were like 45 and they were like I've never dealt with, I've never dealt, dealt defeat or uh, you know not not feeling like I'm number one. But it is interesting that because, because it's because I think they do I don't know they still do it, but I remember I've had, I know, several people who've gone through the process.
Speaker 1:But when you interview for jobs, like a lot of it is like where you ranked in your class, because typically the law class is relatively small and so you know they want to know like where, like where you ranked. So it is it, you're all. You're not just. I think you're not just competing with the people in your class, you're competing with anyone who's going to be getting out around the same time you are, who's going to be applying for those same jobs, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, which is why you start competing even for which law school you go to. Certain law firms will only interview students from certain law schools and then, even if they do interview at your law school, they may only take on, you know, the top 5% or top 3% for even interviews.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. So what type of law did you eventually practice once you started working?
Speaker 2:Where I stood out. So I was not in the top 10% of my class, at least not until third.
Speaker 2:You would have been if you weren't working full time third, you would have been if you weren't working full-time, thank you. I had a seven-year career before that and I was working in the sports industry, so I already knew contracts. I knew what it was to be around television, what it was to be around athletes, stars, copyright-based businesses, license-based businesses, so I already knew the business side of things. And also, being the child of an entrepreneur, right, so I knew what business was like. I understood business. My undergrad is in business.
Speaker 2:So, having that and having seven years already doing that, I became in charge of compliance for a national television station while I was in law school. I already had this resume and so, just kind of continuing to build through that, what do I want to do? And I really felt a calling. I wanted to be in the boardroom. I wanted to be at the main conference table negotiating, because at the time I thought negotiations were done in person. Right, going back to what I did as a kid, I can get in there, I'm not afraid, I'll talk, I'll win.
Speaker 1:I'll persuade.
Speaker 2:But that's not what negotiations are. Negotiations are more on paper. It's more of a back and forth communication in written form. So I ended up learning to take my we'll say my interpersonal skills, my ability to work in the room, work with teams interdepartmental, cross-departmental, all of those things and then bring it to paper, and so that's kind of how my career transitioned, is, I had that base and then I got in with an international company and that's when, and because I had, I fell in love with intellectual property in law school Probably not a surprise based on everything I was doing before it.
Speaker 1:But you don't know if the logic is going to stick in your brain because property law is very different than intellectual property law. Well, there's so many different areas right there, really are. There's so many specializations and then even like Criminal, everything yeah. And specialization within specializations.
Speaker 2:I mean it can get really, really niche, which is, I guess, why there's so many lawyers because there's so many different areas where you could be needed. Human rights. I mean, it's literally how we as citizens, how we as corporations, how everything, how we interact with our government. Our government sets the laws, and how we interact with those things is the lawyers are our communicators, they're our bridge.
Speaker 1:Did you find once you kind of found that you know negotiating intellectual property, kind of phase of law or facet of law, were you happy Like, did you like it?
Speaker 2:Yes and no it was. I kind of hit one of those emotional burnout points kind of quickly, which was interesting because it was doing something I genuinely loved. I love the communicating, I love the problem solving, I love helping and I love being strategic about the problem solving and getting to the root cause of something, not being distracted by the emotions or the egos, but to do that I was triggering my trauma response. This has got to be perfect. This can't be right. I mean, it can't go wrong. People's lives are on the line here, but it's not people's lives, right? I was representing corporations and negotiations. It's not exactly the same, and so my emotional inner response was different than my mental response. It was kind of an inner clash that I still love going through a contract and a license, and I'll be able to quote copyright law on my deathbed.
Speaker 1:That's funny. I hate reading contracts. It's so dense, Like just some of the words like not even in English, you can't even like they're just making stuff up.
Speaker 2:Not every contract, let's just be very clear. Okay, the one's an intellectual property, licensing or certain types of projects for business. There's other times you want to give them your corporation's bylaws. Okay, I will fall asleep. I'm not going to lie, I'm going to charge them. I'll just keep me awake.
Speaker 1:That's funny. So then, at what point then? So you got in point then, so you got in. You knew you were in the right place, like intellectually, but you weren't loving it and you started to experience some burnout. Is that when you started thinking about pivoting to like business coaching and speaking, or was there another phase in between?
Speaker 2:No, there was definitely a phase earlier than that. The first phase was this recognition that I was physically breaking. I'm in my 20s, I'm in the emergency room because I'm having organ failure. I'm constantly sick. I have specialists and special disease doctors telling me we don't know why you're not in the hospital dying. How are you functional? My body was breaking. My body was breaking from the inside out and it was breaking for a lot of reasons.
Speaker 2:From the trauma as a child I never recovered from. My father took his own life right when I was about to start law school, I took on so much at a time where I never got time to learn who I was. So on the outside I was intelligent, I was professional, I was polished, I was ready to rule the world in my 20-some-year-old head right. But inside I never stopped to notice, I never stopped to listen, and so I ended up having not one but two doctors tell me if you don't stop, you're going to die. And one of them was a holistic doctor, she was a homeopath and I'll admit I didn't hear what they were saying.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you were too young.
Speaker 2:Right, I did not hear it, but my body I could understand it. I couldn't give anymore. I couldn't get up, I couldn't do what I needed to do to be me. And so I decided to take a week off. And I my cousin at the time worked for one of the really big international hotel brands. I was like, look, I haven't saved up for this. I'm only two years out of law school, so more debt than I have in my bank than in the bank account. Right and I. But I need to go somewhere. I need to do something now. And she's like here use my, use my discount. And I found an all-inclusive in Jamaica. I had never been told all-inclusive, I had never had that type of vacation. And I just showed up and for five days I didn't think about anything. I had to think about where the food was going to come from, I'd have to think what I was going to do, and it was the first time I ever had that little bit of peace in my life. I'd always been a go go, go, go, go go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no off.
Speaker 2:And so when it came time to my last day on that vacation and I go, it's time to go back to work my entire body tensed up and I needed that contrast to see it. And so from there, I decided to take some family medical leave act, take a few weeks off. Couldn't afford much, but I needed to give myself the space, and that was the first time I ever stopped.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, the all-inclusives are amazing.
Speaker 2:Yes, I try to go off to now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, under different circumstances. But yeah, uh, yeah, it's the. There is. I think there's a lot to that like not having to make decisions. You, I mean there's books about it and stuff where you like even like what you wear, like, you just wear like the same thing, so you don't like decision fatigue.
Speaker 2:He literally wears the same shirt every single day, in the exact same color, so he doesn't have to think about it.
Speaker 1:Right, it seems simple, but those add up over time, even throughout the day. I'm sorry you had to go through it, but it sounds like at least pretty early on in your life then it provided some much needed like you kind of understood the power of rest and taking breaks and not being able to just plow through like everything all the time.
Speaker 2:Yes, I mean. Well, first off, thank you. In hindsight now, though, it's part of an amazing story that gets to be told, and I needed to break to heal. Just because I now saw it didn't mean I knew what to do with it. If that makes sense, right, we all can be like, okay, I need to work out. That doesn't mean we suddenly have the habits and the mindset and the eating and all those things. There's more that needs to go into place. That can be easily put into place if we're ready and we're open to it, but I was clueless, absolutely clueless, so I had to go on a learning journey to get there, but I'm very happy and glad to say I got there.
Speaker 1:Nice. Did you end up hiring like a nutritionist or therapist or life coach or anything, or did you do it just kind of on your own?
Speaker 2:At the time, I didn't know what a life coach was. I had never heard of these things. I didn't know even what a career coach was, other than you know you have your career person who comes with you from your, your college is like if you want to apply for the same jobs that you've already applied for with us. So what had happened was is part of all those physical problems that were happening is my medical doctors. I was tired of paying thousands of dollars for inconclusive test results. I don't have much money, I just didn't. And I and I just got to this point where, like, like, I'm having endoscopies, colonoscopiesies, I may put under everything and there's no answers I was like, no, I, I need an answer, I deserve an answer.
Speaker 2:And so a friend of mine had found she was, she's gluten intolerant, has celiacs, and she's like, look, I go to a homeopath and I'm like, well, that sounds wackadoodle, uh. But that was fearful being told I I'm gluten intolerant. I'm like I don't want to be told, I don't want anything else taken away from me. I can barely hold it together. So I was afraid, fearful. I was going to lose things instead of realizing what I was actually being called to do and I was to heal. So I went and paid out of pocket for a homeopath and the very first appointment she's like you're allergic to dairy and you're gluten intolerant. You look at my stubbornness.
Speaker 2:But once I started to give myself permission to try and heal in a different way, that's when it kind of happened. So I'd say much of it started with the homeopath because I learned there was a different way than what I had been grown up with. You're right, what I grew up with, which was just normal go to school, do the things be this, earn the money, get the health insurance of your company, retire and die. That's the path I was on, that's what I had been raised with and so and I was the first person in my family to go to go to um like get a master's or law school, and so I didn't have examples in my life to show me that there was more that was possible.
Speaker 1:No, I feel that, and I'm the same. You know, I was the first person to graduate from college on my mom's side, since my her father, uh, so it was like a 40 some year gap and, uh, I bought the same thing, Like I had to get a degree, get a job, didn't really matter what it was Just do it and do it for 40 years, try to save some money, maybe take a vacation once a year, and you know 65, 68, retire and then start living and hope your health holds up, and then you have about 10 years and then you're gone. I didn't even really question it. That's the sad part.
Speaker 2:I was like, okay, I guess that's it yeah, it seems to be what everybody else is doing okay right yeah complete herd mentality. I didn't question it I didn't either.
Speaker 1:I was like, okay, and then I had all the jobs that I didn't really like. So I was like, well, this, this isn't really working for me. Then that took 25 years to resolve, anyway. So Exactly. So once you kind of got through that, started to heal, started to feel better, probably started to make some changes in your approach. What were you doing?
Speaker 2:work-wise and then kind of, how did you then proceed? Yeah, no, that's a great question. So I took a break from being a practicing attorney, kept my license and everything and what I did is I sold legal technologies to law firms. So still very much using my legal brain, still negotiating with lawyers, but from a sales perspective, instead of a win the. It was a different meaning. To win the deal is the one it is. It was win the sale instead of win the contract closure. And I went and I did that and what was really interesting is I was kind of better at that than being an attorney. I doubled my salary my first year as a sales rep than I had the year before as an attorney, and that was important to me because it was the first time I understood what it was to follow my heart and how greater success can come when you do what feels right instead of what you think is right.
Speaker 2:I think, like many of us even were considering a career change I'm not going to get more money. I'm an attorney Like, come on, like I'm not going to make more money, I'm going to go do this or do that and I'm going to start at the bottom all over again and the truth is you don't who you are in its entirety carries with you. Maybe you don't use the skills the exact same way, but that doesn't mean you can't use them. That doesn't mean they're not part of who you become. Even on stage as a speaker, what words I come up with, the way I decide to flow a sentence. You know that I could have been a communications major, I could have been an English major. I was a legal person. Right, I know how to write. It's different writing, totally different writing, but it's still writing and so and I'm still up in front of people I'm not afraid to get up there right. So it's same skills, different use, different light from within me, and I would say that is more of kind of what the approach was as I went into the sales and then sales was good and bad. It was closer, better to who I was, but I did like being a lawyer. I just didn't like being a lawyer the way I had been a lawyer. So I ended up moving with my then boyfriend at the time and the world got crazy. Covid happens and I decide something inside me goes. You know, I think it's time you return to being an attorney, but you got to do it differently.
Speaker 2:I was like, okay, don't know what that means, but okay, start my job search with that in mind and, sure enough, the perfect job description comes along. It was just temporary and I liked that. It was a six month. I was going to cover somebody on paternity leave. I'm like, okay, that's a good, put my toe in the water. If I don't like it, I'm only there six months. If I like it, I can progress from there. Within two weeks I fell in love with that job and they fell in love with me. They were offering me a full-time job and I loved it. I loved it and they were the ones who were acquired by the Fortune 500 where I ended up. Just, my career completely took off Again because I followed my heart and did it my way instead of what I thought I was supposed to do. The supposed to wasn't about whether or not I was an attorney. It was how I brought that to life.
Speaker 1:It's a really important point about following your instinct, your heart, your gut, whatever you want to call it and aligning. It's hard for a lot of people, but the closer you can align your work with that, then I think that's where you start to flourish. You start to see success. You feel better about what you're doing, you're better at it. Typically, you can make more money. There's a lot that goes with that, but I think a lot of us who especially fell into the societal trap. We don't really do that. We just end up doing something and then you're like yeah, I guess this is it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, or you think you have to be the best at this, or I've got to compete in this job, in this employer, to get the promotions. And it's like maybe you are meant to get a promotion and do that, but maybe it's not here, maybe it's somewhere else, right, we get so tied up with. I love, love, love. Going back to books who moved my cheese? Who moved my cheese? An amazing book, very simple, it's like 40 something pages long and it's merely about these mice who had cheese. Love the cheese and somebody moves their cheese. It's such a simple, adorable story.
Speaker 2:But learning to be okay with change, not just in the world but within me. I'm glad that I don't think the same way I did when I was 16 or 26 or even 36. So why would I still be in the same job, at the same place that I was when I was 16, 26, or 36? At the same place that I was when I was 16, 26, or 36. And so giving yourself the permissions to continue adapting and feeling the space around you, feeling the space of your job, your home, all of those things, your relationships, and adjusting to what's right, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean that is a great book. I haven't read it in a long time, but I mean the story will stand forever because it's all about evolution and adapting to your environment and if the food's not there anymore.
Speaker 1:you can't keep going back, you've got to go somewhere else. And so many of us you just get, you know, and that's what a lot of the mice end up doing, right, is they just keep going back, thinking, well, it's got to be there today, it's got to be in the. You know, you got to adapt. At what point, then, had you been traveling I know, obviously, the trip to Jamaica but had you been doing any traveling with the law firms? Or at what point did you really start embracing the digital nomad part of it?
Speaker 2:Okay, that's always pieces, right. So I'd say I always had a curiosity about the world. Since I was younger I had a postcard collection. I loved to get the stamps from them. And then my grandmother was taking care of this elderly woman named Rose, and Rose was in her nineties and her and her daughter, and then also her daughter separately, had traveled the world and they sent each other postcards and Rose kept them all and Rose gave them to me. And I remember sitting there one day on my floor, cutting off the stamps and throwing these postcards away. I'm a kid, but there were so many postcards I couldn't get through them all at once, and so in time I stop and I read a postcard and then I read another one and I realized that these postcards were like the history of the world, but through the lens of people, and it was beautiful because it was their American perspective, but somewhere else, about what was happening after the war in this country or what the economy and the textiles were like in this country. And of course it's just a postcard, it's just a few sentences, but it's continued to spark my interest.
Speaker 2:But I grew up in a family I don't think anybody on either side of my family had been to another country in generations. If anything, they left their countries to come to the United States. Right, that would be the next set of international travelers I had is those that emigrated to the United States. And so it was scary. I'm a girl by myself. I was waiting for the husband, for the boyfriend, for somebody to take me, and then my dad dies and my mom's not around and something in me goes. Life is too short, you have to go.
Speaker 2:And I was sitting at the Starbucks and there was a guy from one of the other universities and he and I would just always like save each other a spot at the tables because it got crowded and he had just gotten back from this big world around the world trip with his girlfriend. He would tell me about it. Just more interest, right. And so I remember one of my friends in undergrad. She went as a solo female. She booked with one of those tour companies that you can show up and join a group. She said she didn't love it, but I'm like you came back alive and to me that became the standard You're coming back alive.
Speaker 2:That's all I really needed. I was over the rest of the fears. I was over the rest of the concerns. I just need to come back alive. The second I touched the ground, it was I lit up. I was a whole other person. My friends could not get me to shut up about traveling. I immediately booked my next international trip.
Speaker 1:Where did you go first? Where was the?
Speaker 2:first one was actually to Greece and Turkey.
Speaker 1:Oh nice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was my, my friend at the Starbucks. He was like, well, where do you want to go? And I was like, well, I don't know, I just want. I want history and culture, but I don't want to be overwhelmed. I want good food, but I love nature. And he's like, well, how about Turkey? And I found this thing that was the other part is with work and school. I literally had an eight day window that I could go and not have to take time, right? So I was like, what will fit into this? And there was a trip to Greece and Turkey with the company my friend traveled with, and so I booked it and you made it back.
Speaker 2:I made it back in one piece, extremely excited about the rest of the world and feeling confident as a solo female traveler.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's amazing.
Speaker 2:I've traveled to six continents and I'll be hitting the seventh one next year, yeah.
Speaker 1:I think you just had the recent post about Antarctica right yes, that was me those were some amazing pictures. In the story you told how recent was that and how long were you there.
Speaker 2:That was January of 2023.
Speaker 1:Okay, so pretty recently. And then, how long did you stay?
Speaker 2:So when you're down there, the longest you're actually allowed to be down there is eight days, unless you're on one of the really really like the month ones, just for international treaties. So we were there for the eight days. Yeah, and that's actually touching shore. That did not include the crossing the Drake Passage to get down there or to come back. That was on top of it. I think the total time on the boat was like 12 or 13 days.
Speaker 1:That was amazing. How did you prepare? Prepare gear-wise, I'm assuming you needed special all the cold weather gear the cold weather gear I have here in Indiana, I'm assuming, would not pass Antarctica. How did you upgrade?
Speaker 2:Two parts of the answer is one you were more prepared than you realized, dear sir. So I went with my mom, and my mom had been in Arizona for 40 years, where I had been in Chicago for 10 years back in Wisconsin. I was living in Michigan at the time.
Speaker 1:Oh, so you were. It's probably colder there.
Speaker 2:Exactly so. I remember my mom. She's very much into the gear, always having the right gear, the right stuff, the right luggage. And she's because Antarctica we had booked it two and a half years before we went, so we had plenty of time to prepare. And my mom calls me frantically one day I think it was February she's like I don't know what I'm going to do. How much, how much clothing are you buying? Are you bringing it? And I'm like mom, it's February, it's 17 degrees out and I'm walking the dog right now. It's February, it's 17 degrees out and I'm walking the dog right now. I think I'm going to be okay. I'll just bring some extra stuff for you Because, yeah, in Antarctica, when you go down there, it's their summer, so temperatures sometimes we'll go below freezing but, they're not going to go dramatically far, so what you're already used to in winter is not what you're going to hit in.
Speaker 2:Antarctica summer. Sometimes it can get as warm as 50s or 60s, if you're really lucky, I wouldn't. It mostly hovered low to mid 30s for us day, and night.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, okay, yeah, I think. In my head I was thinking it was like 50 below all the time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, no, I mean, you can have that experience if you want, but you're going to go in the dead of winter when there's no sunlight.
Speaker 1:I was going to say it's dark all the time. Yeah, that's fun.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so which continent have you?
Speaker 1:not been to, have I not been to. Australia, yeah which one have you been to? And then, when are you going Australia? When are you going?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Australia is the one that eludes me, because when I was working it would take so far too scheduled to go there. October I'm doing Nomad Cruise again, that's going to be their 10-year anniversary. And that cruise goes from Seattle. It hits Fiji, Samoa, Hawaii, and then we land in Sydney.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:So, that's when I get to officially wave the seventh continent flag, have that big Instagram photo moment and scream and squeal like a little girl with pure excitement.
Speaker 1:No, that's awesome. I've sworn I'll never get on a cruise ship and so far I've been successful. But I hear why?
Speaker 2:Why is that?
Speaker 1:here. I hear great things about them. I don't know there's something about it's too many people and too close of quarters and I don't. It just makes me. It just makes me uncomfortable. I want to spread out. I don't want to be around like a lot of other people when I vacation. I know those ships are huge and I'm sure it doesn't feel that way when you're there, but I don't know there's something about it. I don't. I don't love it.
Speaker 2:I hear you and I can see that, like any type of trip, right, there's different types of hotels based on how you are. If you're co-living, are you a hostel? Are you a high-end this? Are you an Airbnb? There's a cruise for everybody, but that would mean making sure that you're picking the right one for you for sure, because, yeah, some of them like the ones that are more easily accessible, like the carnivals and the Royal Caribbean, because that's how they get you. You get in there and it's like it's $250 for five days, why not? And then you're like oh, I see, okay.
Speaker 1:I got what I paid for.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, don't get me wrong I've traveled with them and they are a wonderful time, amazing value for what you get. But yeah, the boat is packed, it's right, it's a different standard More than that for a large suite and the luxury balcony and the fine dining, but it doesn't sound like you would want to pay that just to try something when you have other forms of travel that you love. What's your favorite style of travel?
Speaker 1:What do you do? Well, mostly I like to drive, so we do a lot of long driving trips in the States. We have been to Hawaii. I'd love to go back. I don't love super long flights. I'm not afraid to fly, but I don't know. Again, it's a lot of people in a tight space, which is not my favorite thing. Car is better because there's just four of us, and now these days my kids are just plugged into their devices, so really it's like two of and peaceful. But yeah, I like to travel. I don't do it as much as I would like to. My first job was selling pharmaceuticals, and so we did travel.
Speaker 1:We had a conference in Vegas, I went to Anaheim, New Orleans, multiple trips to New Jersey, New York City, stuff like that. So that was probably the most I did in a relatively short period of time. But yeah, these days mostly driving, long driving road trips, which I kind of enjoy.
Speaker 2:My whole thing started on long road trips. As a child I was in the backseat a lot listening to my Walkman and my three cassettes. Three cassettes doesn't even get you through Texas.
Speaker 1:Those cassettes are short, short. My oldest son, he's 15. He found a cassette tape recently and my wife was trying to like explain to him like how it worked, and he, he was like I don't what there's music like on the on the film, like what do you mean? And she was like, well, right, like you would put it in the player and then press play and then the tape goes forward and he was like what?
Speaker 1:he couldn't comprehend it. It was like so foreign to him and I'm old enough to remember eight tracks like I can remember yeah my mom had this eight track and it was a the blues brother soundtrack and I remember I would.
Speaker 1:I was fascinated because it would light up and so I would press the the lever and then it would go to three to four and I would love. I loved watching the lights when I was super young and it made a really cool sound too. So, yeah, so I remember this. But yeah, he was really. You know, I mean he's born in 09, you know, yeah, even even cds. I mean he's familiar with cds, but it's his most of his life has all been streaming, um, you know, spotify or youtube, if he wants to listen to anything on the cloud, something non-tangible other than what it takes to play it so like.
Speaker 1:The other thing is they don't understand is like you know, we used to have to wait for songs to come on the radio, so you would like oh, they're playing this song now. His whole world is a digital jukebox. He can listen to anything he wants, anytime he wants, and it's so. There's no, you don't get that like oh yeah, I love hearing the song. It's like oh yeah, I can hear that anytime. But it was really interesting watching his brain try to comprehend this plastic tape with the small words at the top. He's like these are the songs. And it's like why is it so small? It's like well, they don't have a lot of space.
Speaker 2:Then you had to rewind it be kind rewind yes.
Speaker 1:That's fun. So you've traveled. Clearly that lights you up. You love the adventure and just the food and the people and the different places. And so then, at what point did you start thinking about telling your story like on a stage, and was it like a combination of what you'd been through, or was there like a spark where you're like I want to speak?
Speaker 2:I don't remember when the seed first got planted and I don't really recall it being connected to travel if I'm honest, as weird as it might be, although travel is. When I started communicating, travel is what my first blog was about, so I felt comfortable enough, knowing that I knew it in a way that I could help others, and so that was the first time I was in that stance where I could help others help themselves, unlike a lawyer where I'm helping others by defending them or protecting them. As a blog, I'm helping you, help you in written form. And then I don't remember, there was somewhere along the lines in my back half of my final year abroad, living out of my luggage. I was literally, I had was homeless, right, I didn't have an address here in the States, and that's when somehow the seed got planted. I was like I think it's time that I go be a speaker. I'd been on stage occasionally from my childhood. Then I was, you know, in mock trial moot court debate. I've given business presentations and been I think it was that I was a mock trial moot court debate. I've given business presentations. I think it was that.
Speaker 2:I was a corporate trainer. As the lawyer, I was our main trainer for all different the legal team, the global legal team, as well as the sales team. I was our person. I really really started to be good at it in a way that I just got passionate and my colleagues noticed that to where they just started to let me be the trainer. It's kind of what it was. It was just like I go to Acacia for that and I started to embrace that. And then I remember thinking on my way back to the United States that I want to be a speaker now, but I wanted to do with my own personal story and I don't remember why, but I remember asking the universe and going through the process of manifestation in order to bring it about and I think that's one of the reasons the universe brought me to Vegas. It was one of the reasons I could see the connection to Vegas. I mean, there's so many events here.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:What conference has it been in Vegas?
Speaker 1:at some, point All the time.
Speaker 2:So getting to do that, I think, is one of the reasons it brought me here, and I'm going to kind of go into one of the deeper little, darker sides of my personal story here and that's the day I moved into my home. Like I said, I'm in a condo, I'm in a high rise. I am literally in the lobby waiting for my agent to bring me my keys. I had closed just over an hour before, so I'm about to be homeowner for the first time. Hell yes, and my agent is running late and instead of her walking in, a man walked in with an assault rifle and he began shooting.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:And that process with my mother my mother was there with me was obviously extremely scary. That process with my mother my mother was there with me was obviously extremely scary. It was nerve wracking and the experience for us lasted 40 minutes, even though we now know the true experience wasn't that long. But we didn't know that right and we heard a lot of gunfire. It was really, really scary and I had to process a lot.
Speaker 2:In those moments I had to wonder if this is the end of my life. What have I accomplished? What haven't I accomplished? What do I do with my mother? Do I protect her? Does she protect me? What do we do here? Like? I'm in a place I've never been before, in a way I've never thought I would ever experience, and we come out of it physically unharmed. Nobody passed away that day, nobody died. Only injury was the gunman when he was taken down by security, thankfully.
Speaker 2:But in my trauma I go through PTSD. I do. This is my home. I have to walk through that lobby every single day. I'm being traumatized over and over again every day. But I had been through trauma before as a child. I know how to heal. I had already healed. I'd already spent almost a decade healing from all of that. I know how to heal and so I wasn't afraid. I was afraid in one way, but I wasn't afraid of what I needed to do and what I needed to process to heal.
Speaker 2:And two amazing things happened. One, as I was about to be hit with the massive tidal wave that comes when you let those emotions surge up. Right, it's not an easy one. It can sometimes spark a panic attack Is my subconscious brain cuts in, shuts down the emotions dead in their tracks and goes no, you can choose to see this differently. You can choose to see love instead. And it was a line from a book I had read earlier that year. I had read just when I got back from Antarctica, in fact, and the book was May Cause Miracles by Gabby Bernstein, and it I don't know why this thought literally came out of nowhere. It was like a self-defense mechanism, but I go oh my God. Of course I can see this all differently.
Speaker 2:I was in like survival mode again in my life, different type of survival mode, but in survival mode I was in a different type of panic. That's not everything. I am right now because right now I am safe. Right now I know what I'm capable of Right now. I know I am ready and capable of healing, and so I chose to see it all differently emotionally, but mentally I was, for better or worse. The legal brain is a legal brain. It doesn't stop, it keeps going.
Speaker 2:So I was reliving those pictures of that day over and over again. What his face looked like, what he was wearing, what was the gun like, what were the sounds of shots, right, all of that it's a cassette in your head, over and over again. And so I decide well, if I'm going to see love, I, over and over again. And so I decide well, if I'm going to see love, I have to relive it looking for love. And that's what I did. I closed my eyes and I relived every moment, every scary, panic moment of that day looking for love.
Speaker 2:What I discovered is the reasons I was panicking and scared is because I loved something. I'm scared I'm going to lose my mom because I love her. I'm scared I'm going to die because I love my life. I'm scared I'm going to get hurt because I love my body. Every deep moment of fear was actually representation of how much I deeply loved something, and so I got to turn my pain and my fear into a form and reason to be grateful, to turn my pain and my fear into a form and reason to be grateful.
Speaker 2:And when I started to look at it through, that lens massive changes, not just for me, because my brain goes that's the ending to your story, that's the ending to your talk. I never would have learned those things in those moments. I would have never seen how much I had grown from that traumatized child who didn't know how to process or have an emotion. I would have never known she had grown into this, this powerful woman who could find love and scary things if I didn't have that shooting experience. And so because I know nobody got hurt, because I know right, and what's really weird is almost nobody was there Like other people, weren't even mentally traumatized. There were very few of us. So it was almost like the universe put me there for a reason.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:To have this realization, to have the tipping point in my story that I can show and prove that this really does work and you can be this no matter what comes your way. And so part of telling my story was again that manifesting the universe gave me something shitty. I am not going to say I wanted that. I am not going to say I would have ever chosen that, but any more than I would have chosen my abusive childhood.
Speaker 2:I needed it. I needed it to help others. I needed to tell the right story the right way, in a way that's going to inspire and transform others, and so that conclusion there, that became a massive tipping point. Now it's like I am ready, I am ready, and so I went and I got the speaking coach. I was up to give a TEDx talk here at UNLV. I went and told my story in other places, and so the universe told me I was ready. It showed me I was ready and it made sure I was ready, and now it does most of the work for me.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. I mean, what a horrifying story. I don't know too many people that would have relived it through a tunnel of love. I think most would have fought it and looked at it through fear, which is how you experienced it the first time. That's amazing. There's somebody I was like. Six months ago I was on a call with someone and they said something similar in terms of when you're making a decision, try to make a decision out of love, not fear, because so many of us are kind of held back by our own self-doubt and imposter syndrome and you know all of that and worst case scenario and what if it doesn't work? What if I fail? Which I think is just programmed into us like the psychological safety there, we all have.
Speaker 1:Yes right that our brains, trying to keep us safe so we try to it tries to talk us out of doing those scary type things. And she was like what if you like, what if you choose love? What if you just choose it? So very similar to what a different circumstance, but similar to what you did to to try to process it and do it just a more positive way, which is, like I said, I don't think too many people could do it. So that's, that's amazing.
Speaker 2:I can tell you that before 2023, I probably wouldn't have done that either. Yeah right, that's Right. That's what kind of came from there and one of the books I'm reading right now. I feel like it's just like a big podcast interview about books.
Speaker 1:I know why you're starting a book club now.
Speaker 2:Yes, I know why I started a book club. I love books. It's called A Course in Miracles, and you do just a little bit every single day. It's not like a sit down and read a book, it's kind of a mini lessons along on your life book.
Speaker 2:But the one I'm actually on this week is there are no neutral thoughts. Every thought you have is either for love or for fear, and so the task simply is throughout your day when you notice you're having a thought I hate traffic, I hate sitting in traffic. Wait, that's not a neutral thought. That's coming out of fear, anger, pain. Okay, let's let that go. I only want loving things in my life. I don't have to sit here and turn it into love. But I can reject the idea of it being negative, right, I can observe that and choose to not follow it emotionally into it. And so that's been really illuminating for me, just practicing that little thing there. Because, like you said, we do tend to go towards the fear, because that's what triggers our safety, that's what triggers prevention of harm, that's what prolongs us and our brain is hardwired to do that, to protect us. It is important.
Speaker 1:No, yeah, I think the other book you referenced was Miracle. So you like books with the title Miracle?
Speaker 2:That is pure coincidence, but one is a derivative of the other, which is how I got to, after what May Cause Miracles did for me the shooting. I thought it was time to honor the full scope, which is A Course in Miracles, but A Course in Miracles is for me the shooting. I thought it was time to honor the full scope, which is A Course in Miracles. But A Course in Miracles is a year long.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow.
Speaker 2:It's a commitment, which is why it took me so long to make the commitment.
Speaker 1:So how do you set up your time now? So you're doing speaking and then you do coaching. How do you set up your time and how are you spending your time in terms of work?
Speaker 2:Yeah, what's really great is I'm kind of a big believer in the manifesting right Inspired manifesting. What am I inspired to do when I am sitting in that feeling of success? And so most speaking gigs don't happen all day, every day, right, they're here and there, which is nice, because then I can work the coaching clients around them, I can work the social media around that. Of course I have an assistant that it would be a little too difficult to get everything done. She's not a full-time assistant but, like all of us, I need help too, Right, and I'm not a miracle worker on my own and so just trying to get into a rhythm on the things that need regular habits and the things that don't make sure I'm flexible to do that, right, If a conference happens next weekend and that's when they need me, okay, either it's a yes or a no.
Speaker 2:Am I in town? Is this where I can be? Am I ready with the type of talk they need? If not, do I have the bandwidth to get it done, to get it prepared, that type of thing. But also, as you do anything, you're not starting from scratch, right? I've written enough talks now and I've got. I think I'm coming out with four more in the next year. So it's you know you can piece things from other lessons that you've written, other content maybe social media content, podcasts, whatever it is and you know work that and when you work the words right, they can become habitual, which is really nice. And so you find the short, little succinct ways to just be in the moment and trust the words are going to come out the right way. And it's the same with my day to day.
Speaker 1:Nice. So what's the future? You'll be in Australia in 10 or 11 months. That touches off the continent. It checks off the continents. What's the future hold? What do you want to do? Gosh geez, you. Continent that checks off the continents. What's the future hold? What do you?
Speaker 2:want to do Gosh geez, you know that's not a simple answer. I just even asked you what your goals were for the podcast the next year and it was still a five-minute answer. And that's just the podcast part of what you do, which I'm really excited for. I love this podcast of yours.
Speaker 1:Thank you.
Speaker 2:Well, so, keeping it short, I am becoming a university instructor. I start instructing at one of the local universities in the spring, so I'll be doing that, teaching critical thinking. But what's great is I'm going to be combining these other elements of you. Know, like we are human, we have a spiritual, we have an energetic, we have our emotional side. So what is that with thinking? Where does thinking fit in to all of that and where does it not? Where do we need to stop thinking and be human? Then I actually go to Africa. It'll be my second trip to Africa with my mom. That'll be more of a vacation style trip. It'll be about two weeks long. We're going to hit Kenya and Tanzania.
Speaker 1:Nice.
Speaker 2:Then and I'm also going to start focusing more on the travel blog getting more of that content out. I've taken a whole lot of video footage in my two years while I was abroad and I published almost none of it.
Speaker 1:Wow, okay.
Speaker 2:So one of my dear friends, he just moved into the co-working space that I work out of here and he's like I'm ready to start my career as a video editor and I'm like I got a job for you, I've got 24 months of footage.
Speaker 2:But it also does mean I want to sit down and tell the story. What was it to grow as a person? What was it to become fearless? What fears did I have to face? What were me? What was my environment? And then, of course, the hey can you work on the road? Is that even possible? How were you a lawyer on the road? That seems really impossible. You work on the road? Is that even possible? How were you a lawyer on the road? That seems really impossible.
Speaker 2:And you know, say those stories and give it value, reason, a storytelling moment behind the footage. So I'll be focusing on that in early 2025 as well. Then I'm back on Nomad Cruise, yep, and I'll be speaking as well as giving a workshop on Nomad Cruise. Again. I do have some other podcasts and things in the works in the meantime. And then a big one for me next year is also going to be Suicide Prevention Week and Mental Health. Those are going to be really, really big for me. One of the talks I want to focus on is helping professionals who are thought process oriented, like engineers, lawyers, those of us that were told and taught that for success you have to put your emotions aside. No emotions belong here, and so you've risen to success using your mind. How do we become whole again? How do we get through the awkwardness? I remember the first time somebody asked me in an art class how does it make you feel? And I went ew, how does it make you feel?
Speaker 1:Yeah, what are you talking?
Speaker 2:about. So that's a big talk that I look forward to seeing how it's not quite ready, but I look forward to seeing how that lands in 2025 as well, that sounds like a very active year.
Speaker 1:I love that you're teaching a class on critical thinking. I think that should be taught much earlier in the school system. I think it's a real deficit that I see I don't spend a lot of time around young kids, but what little I do. That just seems to be something that's missing. They just don't have that ability to take information, assess it, really think about it and then move forward based on that. Like it's like that step is just skipped. So I don't know if that's just generational or it's not taught. They don't know, I'm not sure. So I love that that's something that some university is offering and that you're teaching it. Hopefully more are doing something similar, because there's a real, it is a learned skill and it can be very important.
Speaker 2:It really is. To me, critical thinking has been sort of my social media and media headline blocker. It's kind of like spam blocker, ad blocker. I can let through what I want to get through, but I also can think for myself and I don't just take something on its face and value. But I also can think for myself and I don't just take something on its face and value or I can choose to if I want to, but understanding that. But it's also important for me that, as I teach critical thinking, that I'm not teaching people to overthink or to put your emotions aside, to put who you are aside, that gut feeling, because they matter too in the equation. But they're both individual parts of the equation and we want to strengthen them both.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure, that's a great point. I feel like we could at least go another hour, but we won't do that today. But it's been great having you on. I love your energy, I love your story, the way you've risen above some pretty unpleasant things and how you're shining today. I think it's a great illustration and a great example for others, so I really appreciate coming on and sharing it.
Speaker 2:Thank you, david. I mean thanks for reaching out right. We had been following each other on LinkedIn for a while, but we both kind of like we knew when it was time to just let the other parts of each of us shine, and I love that. I love your transition that you're doing to here in 2025, right, you're following your heart, you're following your passion and you're making that equation in your daily life the way you want and to better balance, and I love it. And it's already coming through. It's already coming through and your year hasn't even started. So thank you for being you in this podcast. I love it.
Speaker 1:Oh, thank you, that's very kind of you. I appreciate that a lot and the podcast has been great and I just I love, I love doing it. I love hearing people's stories. Just again, I find it so motivating and energizing and and just it's a fascinating process. So very happy that I started it and very fortunate to have just so many great people that have come on and shared their journey. And that's what we're all on right, it's all one. It's all one big journey. We never know when it's going to stop.
Speaker 2:One big storybook, yep.
Speaker 1:Exactly so. Any final words Welcome to hear any final thoughts, and then I'll let people know if they're interested in finding out more about you or getting in touch with you, like the best ways to do that.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. What I would say is just always follow your heart, know that it is always possible. Fear takes us in one direction. There are no neutral thoughts. Flip them into love. Because there are no neutral thoughts. Flip them into love because just choosing love in places where you thought it was absolutely impossible for it to exist, in the deepest, darkest moments of life. It even exists there, but we've got to be brave enough to go for it. But I promise you it's there, no matter what. It is a career change, switching up your friends in your life, or facing something traumatic and horrible we can find love on the other side of all of it for sure. And if you, my website is acaciathortoncom, and then, of course, you can always follow me on LinkedIn, acacia Thornton. As far as I'm aware, I'm the only Acacia Thornton on there.
Speaker 1:I am not the only David Young, so you win there. Yeah, I'll put your. I'll put the website and your LinkedIn profile link. That'll be in the show notes. And again, thank you so much for again your time, your energy and your insight, love the conversation and I really appreciate you.
Speaker 2:Thank you, David Same.